Odd thoughts

[valarltd]

I had inspiration while driving.

It occurs to me that while flower-fairies will be sweet and sell, I really really want to write the Rapture Horror Novel.

Has anyone done a horror novel where God is the biggest monster of all?
(or is that, itself, cliche?)

There are 2.1 Billion Christians in the world. Assume 1.4 billion vanish in the rapture (that's about 2/3rd). That's everyone from Fred Phelps and Rick Santorum to Pope Ratzinger and Bishop Robinson to the lovely lady down the block who gives half of her fixed income to the local soup kitchen. (in fairness, she probably has a better chance than the first three)

Think about the chaos caused by 1.4 BILLION people vanishing into thin air, 150 million of them here in the US.
People who are not just sleeping and eating and praying, but people who are flying planes and driving cars and operating heavy machinery and fighting fires and doing life-saving surgery.

How many people are going to die in car accidents when driverless cars--or worse, semis!--plow into them? How many planes are going to crash?

And those people have jobs. Vital jobs. The supply chain to stores will be disrupted. There will be food shortages, even before the droughts and the locusts and the famines and crop failures. First responders will be short of help. Utilities may have trouble. All services will be disrupted.

What's life going to be like for the folks picking up the pieces after Mr. Christian Trucker has an "O Hai Jesus!" moment and vanishes, letting his cruise-controlled rig plow blithely on its way, into the minivans full of mom and kids? Or for the non-Christian ministers, dealing with every pregnant woman in their flock suddenly having the baby vanish, and every mother of preschoolers wailing for her loss?

And then the supernatural stuff starts:
meteors that poison the water
droughts
Earthquakes
the sun going black
1/4 of the population dying from food shortages and animal attacks (we're down to 3.5 billion!)
locust plagues
food shortages
Wars to kill another 1/3rd of the people (we're down to 2.3 billion!)
Witnesses who bring a three year drought
The Antichrist shows up AFTER all this.
70-lb hailstones
a plague of darkness and boils
a huge battle where everyone dies and the birds glut themselves.

Tell me this shouldn't be written as a horror novel...

Comments

[jess-faraday.livejournal.com]

Damn, dude, that'd be a great horror story, but you'd get death threats for sure.

[synamontwist.livejournal.com]

The movie "The Rapture" starring Mimi Rogers. Psycological Thriller starring God(although he never really shows up).

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

I wondered if someone had done a serious look at this, without the "Oh, God makes it all right" part.

[deza.livejournal.com]

No matter how you spin it, you will get compared to the Left Behind novels. You know this, right?

[tsita.livejournal.com]

Kinda what I was thinking.

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

I know. That's the point. "Left behind for those who will be left behind."

My goal is to do it better than LaHaye and Jenkins. Better than Lindsay and better than Salem Kirban (who had some of the most horrendous visions for the end, even among the elite)

[jess-faraday.livejournal.com]

It wouldn't be difficult to do better than LaHaye and Jenkins. The writing is appalling, and the characters, at least the female characters are the worst kinds of stereotypes.

[faedreamer.livejournal.com]

I love the concept but yeah, Left Behind covered that like whoa, though from a "It's all good in the end cause is GAWD!" slant (if I recall correctly anyway. I was 13 when my parents still forced me to go to church and our youth group watched the movie versions. Creeptastic).

I told Naomi the other day about how freaking badly I've been wanting to write an erotic Urban Fantasy where Lucifer/Satan is the hero. Like I'm the only one who thinks the poor guy got a seriously bad rap via the heavenly gossip chain? :)

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

Have Naomi send you a copy of Tuition Fees.
And see the TV series "Brimstone."

Left Behind is after my time. I grew up on A Thief in the night. I found it terrifying.

I want it to be an absolute nightmare for the people living through it, and although they KNOW why it's happening and who is causing it, they have their own faiths and refuse to be bullied.

[gehayi.livejournal.com]

No matter how you write it, it's going to be taken as a religious novel, just like the Left Behind tripe.

The Book of Revelation doesn't fit into the categories of either real-world horror or supernatural horror. That's one of the big problems with this premise.

What's life going to be like for the folks picking up the pieces after Mr. Christian Trucker has an "O Hai Jesus!" moment and vanishes, letting his cruise-controlled rig plow blithely on its way, into the minivans full of mom and kids?

What's life going to be like? In a word, brief.

And you've just mentioned something else that will get you linked to the Left Behind tripe. The Rapture.

Now, most Christian sects don't believe that the Rapture is going to happen; it is not generally accepted. John Nelson Darby, a member of the sect of the Plymouth Brethren, came up with the notion of the pre-Trib Rapture in 1827. The concept has not existed for long, and has been so strongly embraced by fundie wingnuts that I think it would be a horrible idea to use it.

Or for the non-Christian ministers, dealing with every pregnant woman in their flock suddenly having the baby vanish, and every mother of preschoolers wailing for her loss?

And this is another reason why you shouldn't write this--the basic assumptions in this statement.

1) Why do you assume that the non-Christians would be--there's that title again!--Left Behind? If that's happening simply because they're not Christian, you may not be telling the story that you think you're telling.

2) Why would God murder all the kids? Seriously, that does NOT sound like a benevolent being, or anything worthy of being worshipped at all. (And don't tell me it's not murder; the kids are supposed to be in heaven, right? Well, you don't go to heaven unless you're DEAD.)

3) Third, the Left Behind series makes a fairly big deal about fetuses vanishing from their mothers' uteruses, babies just being born and disappearing, small children evaporating--seriously, it's EXTREMELY like the scenario you describe. I don't think there's a way you could do it that hasn't been done already.

How many people are going to die in car accidents when driverless cars--or worse, semis!--plow into them? How many planes are going to crash?

Again--straight out of the first Left Behind novel. The main characters meet on a plane that starts to crash because the pilot and co-pilot get vaporized. (Fortunately, there is a pilot aboard who did not get wafted into the great wherever.) And all kinds of car crashes and burning wrecks are described as people make their way home.

There are 2.1 Billion Christians in the world. Assume 1.4 billion vanish in the rapture (that's about 2/3rd).

Why do only the Christians get Raptured? That's weird. And unjust. And fairly political, considering that you're essentially saying that all Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Taoists, Confucians, followers of nature religions, neo-Pagans, Baha'i, Jainists, practitioners of Voudon, etc. are all going to Hell because...because why?

Think about the chaos caused by 1.4 BILLION people vanishing into thin air, 150 million of them here in the US.

And here you run into the real problem with this premise.

It's NOT POSSIBLE.

You're talking about a horror story set in, presumably, the real world or its close cousin. That makes hash of the premise. People do not become nothingness. It violates all the laws of the universe. It shatters its own continuity; it does not make sense.

Mind you, if I were reading a Star Trek story, I'd have no trouble accepting the existence of a transporter. If I were reading an urban fantasy novel, I'd accept the existence of magic, vampires, werewolves, magical creatures, etc.

But you're trying to have it both ways--real life horror with supernatural causes, and supernatural horror in a real life setting.

Probably some of the audience for religious books would believe it. But that's not the audience you're aiming for. You're aiming for horror. And this just doesn't fit the intended market. You're talking about a proposed book that has practically no audience at all.

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

Why would life be brief for the peoiple picking up the pieces, clearing the roads and dealing with the mess the Christians left?

Most Christians I know do believe in the Rapture. Many of them look forward to it like it's going to be Christmas and their birthday and every good thing rolled into one. The rest dread it. Then again, these are people whose idea of a practical joke is to leave piles of clothes around the campus of the college so the poor schmuck who forgot the daylight savings changeover thinks he's been forgotten by God.

1) Only Christians get to go because it's the Christian god playing out his Grand Guignol end-times scenario. Makes no sense for him to take those who aren't his. (At one point I considered leaving all the women behind, regardless of faith, because Eve is never actually ensouled back in Genesis)

2)Because it's what the Hebrew god DOES. Haven't you read your Bible? The flood, the plagues of Egypt, David's child by Bathsheba, the 42 kids eaten by bears for making fun of a Prophet. Seriously, the idea is that the children are caught up alive--like everyone else--and will be back for the Millennium.

3) Left Behind is copycatting a great deal of Rapture literature that came before. It's a trope. And the women in LB never seem particularly disturbed.

We see what you describe in LB (again, trope of the genre), but we are never on the ground mopping up afterward or coping with the crap. Aside from stage dressing, the L:B world rolls merrily along as it always did,

Only Christians get raptured because it's their god. And not even ALL Christians go. It is weird. And unjust. And terrifying. And THAT is the point.

Your suspension of disbelief is weak. We're talking about an all-powerful deity. Can we not assume he can translate people straight to heaven?

The idea is aimed at the people who think we have any common cause with people who are grimly and joyfully waiting for this nightmare to happen, because they plan to sit on the heavenly sidelines and watch while everyone else suffers.

[gehayi.livejournal.com]

Why would life be brief for the peoiple picking up the pieces, clearing the roads and dealing with the mess the Christians left?

Because I was picturing them getting run over by Mr. Christian Trucker's eighteen-wheeler. That's why.

Most Christians I know do believe in the Rapture.

Really? I don't know of a single one who does. And I know a fair number of Christians.

1) Only Christians get to go because it's the Christian god playing out his Grand Guignol end-times scenario. Makes no sense for him to take those who aren't his.

Oooookay. See, the idea that only the Christians are his and everyone else can go hang? That's really, REALLY offensive. Another problem with this premise.

2)Because it's what the Hebrew god DOES. Haven't you read your Bible? The flood, the plagues of Egypt, David's child by Bathsheba, the 42 kids eaten by bears for making fun of a Prophet. Seriously, the idea is that the children are caught up alive--like everyone else--and will be back for the Millennium.

Sure I've read it. Several times. It's a singularly boring book of fairy tales, but eh, some people like it.

However, you're not dealing with an ancient book of fairy tales. You're talking about an actual novel with plot and character development. And that means that it would be good if God's behavior made some sense. Just saying, "That's the way it happened in the Bible!" isn't enough.

Only Christians get raptured because it's their god. And not even ALL Christians go. It is weird. And unjust. And terrifying. And THAT is the point.

God can treat people like crap if he wants to. He often wants to. Yes, I get that.

Is that the point? I'm sorry, I'm just baffled.

We're talking about an all-powerful deity. Can we not assume he can translate people straight to heaven?

Not everyone is going to see God the same way, or accept that that there is a God at all.

Mind you, disagreement over canon wouldn't matter in most cases. You could posit sparkly vampires, as Meyer did, and while people would grumble about folklore, most people would swallow it for the sake of the story.

But this isn't fantasy. Or at least it isn't what most people would call fantasy. It's religion. And religious attitudes--like the conceit that only Christians go to heaven or that God has no interest in anyone of any other faith--have roots in a lot of blood-stained history. You can't lightly say such things without hurting someone who had a friend or a family who suffered and/or died for being the wrong religion.

And religion, at the best of times, is a very titchy subject. You're already upset because I'm not buying this premise.

The idea is aimed at the people who think we have any common cause with people who are grimly and joyfully waiting for this nightmare to happen, because they plan to sit on the heavenly sidelines and watch while everyone else suffers.

Which means that it has no audience at all. If they think that sitting in heaven and watching other people suffer for their entertainment is even vaguely good and virtuous, why would they choose to read their dearest fantasies packaged as a horror story? Either they don't want to think about how others will suffer, or they have revved themselves up to the point where they think those who haven't floated off into the ether deserve all the misery they get. Which is small, spiteful and petty, but I doubt if you can argue them out of it. They want validation of their beliefs, and whether you approve or not, that's probably how they will read it. (Well, that or blasphemy, because if God is the monster, does that make the Antichrist the hero?)

I'm sorry, Angelia, but I really don't think that this will work. It's too sensitive and too political a topic, some of the premises are not, shall we say, ecumenical, and I don't know who would read it.

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

I grew up Christian although I no longer am. My mother--in her down moods--would refuse to take me to mandatory after-school events. "What does it matter if you fail? The Rapture will come before you're out of high school." She lived and lives her whole life never expecting to see any major milestone. (her oldest grandchild will graduate high school in a year)

And she is typical of the people I grew up around. I was in my 20s before I met Christians who didn't believe in it. I was in my late 30s before I met clergy who had never heard of it.

The idea is to take all those spiritually uplifting books about the event, in which nothing really bad ever happens to the newly-Christian protagonist--although a near relative might be martyred--and turn them on their head. I am attempting to lampshade an entire genre.

That means I have to play by the major rules of the genre: only Christians get raptured. The Christian god is not ecumenical, although he does have work for the Jews. (Asking why only Christians go is like asking why vampires only drink blood)

It's not fantasy. And it's not religion. It's horror. And if you don't accept the baseline premises--vampires drink blood, werewolves change on the full moon and this particular god only likes Christians--any horror is going to fall flat.

And I'm cranky because you never seem to have anything by squelching comments about how every idea sucks and will never work.

And yes, it is touchy and political. That's the only sort of thing really worth writing.

Who would read it: mainline protestants uneasy with premillennialist theology. Walk-aways from premillennialism. Pagans (one of the main characters is). Even premillennialists who are a) uneasy or b) looking for torture porn, with the blood running as deep as the horses' bridles.

[celestinenox]

"O Hai Jesus!"

::snickers::

[celestinenox]

Also, I would read it. Just so you know.

[tannenwynn.livejournal.com]

There's a role-playing game called The End [by Tyranny Games] that was produced on the premise of the rapture. The blurb on the back reads thusly:

My God, My God, Why Hast Thou Forsaken Me?
The year is 2006. The Day of Judgement has dawned and the Lord God did separate the wheat from the chaff, the sinners from the virtous, the damned from the saved. One hundred forty thousand souls felt the Rapture and were assumed into Heaven.

Then came the Day of Reckoning. Those who had marked their heads, hands, and hearts with the mark of the Beast were cast into the lake of fire. Mankind's lordship over the beasts was ripped from him. The four Horsemen of the Apocalypse were loosed upon the unrighteous. The great Beast was given free reign to roam the wastelands and a third of the stars were ripped from the Heavens by the wings of Michael the Archangel. In the end, Death claimed almost every human that lived.

Then things went horribly wrong. God's hand fell upon the dust that was neither wheat nor chaff... those in this brave age who had chosen neither God nor his Adversary. The Risen Christ could not damn them for their sins, but nor could he allow them to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

God's greatest creation, Mankind, was finally left to his own devices. They have many names, the Meek, the Lost Souls, the Forsaken, but they have all learned the same thing: "The Meek shall inherit the Earth" was not a promise... it was a warning.

They did a very good job explaining the insidious horror intrinsic to the scenario, and not quite so much on the blatant effects of God.

And I'd read it.

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

Except they got it wrong. The 144,000 aren't raptured. They're virgin Jews left on earth to do God's work.

But the game has an interesting premise. Basically, the remnant of humanity has become Jack-o-Lantern: cursed to wander as neither side wants them.